在眾籌網站上發現的永遠旋轉的未開發客戶群

Felix ：在這一集中，您將了解他們用來確定銷售什麼的標準、如何吸引不會說英語的 Kickstarter 支持者加入您的活動，以及為什麼要在 Kickstarter 和 Indiegogo 上啟動。 今天，來自 ForeverSpin.com 的 Viktor Grabovskyy 加入了我的行列。 ForeverSpin 是一家加拿大公司，致力於製造世界上最好的陀螺。 它始於 2013 年，總部位於加拿大多倫多。 歡迎維克托。

維克多：你好菲利克斯。 能上節目真是太好了。

菲利克斯：太好了。 告訴我們更多關於您的故事以及您銷售的產品是什麼？

維克多：當然。 ForeverSpin 本質上是一個非常高品質、非常優雅的金屬陀螺系列，現在有 18 種不同的金屬和飾面，從鋁到鈦再到不銹鋼、鎢和銅。 有 18 種不同的品種，所以我們經歷了非常廣泛的 f 金屬，但實際上它是一個非常高質量的陀螺系列。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 你一直對陀螺感興趣嗎？ 你是如何參與開店的。 我想我們稍後會討論這個問題，但是您首先發起了 Kickstarter 活動，但是您是如何參與創建陀螺的？

維克多：事實上，我這輩子都不是陀螺的忠實粉絲。 這是我從小就記得的東西，但我一直是你可以握在手中的物品的粉絲，有觸覺體驗的物品，你可以坐立不安的東西。 現在我確實有兩個商業夥伴。 其他兩個商業夥伴確實是我今天所說的陀螺項目的靈感來源。 我們決定讓產品栩栩如生，真正是質量非常高的產品，我們可以為之付出一定程度的卓越。

我們開始檢查一些標準，在我們的頭腦風暴會議中檢查我們的標準，通過我們的價值觀，我們發現我們所有人都記得木製陀螺是我們的第一個玩具。 在那次體驗中，我們決定讓它變得非常優雅、非常時尚和時尚，並用不常見的金屬製成。

費利克斯：聽起來你們有一種非常有條理的方法來弄清楚……嗯，聽起來你們都想創業。 你想開始做某事，你們有一個標準列表或某種練習，你們通過這些練習來弄清楚你應該開始什麼，應該賣什麼。 你能和我們談談你經歷的那個練習嗎，因為我認為這是很多企業家經歷的一種情況或一個階段，他們有創業的靈感，但不確定如何縮小選擇範圍這裡。 你能和我們談談你們是如何縮小選擇範圍的嗎？

維克多：當然。 為了讓您了解一下我們公司的歷史，我們實際上並不是從產品本身開始的。 我們確實開始與一些軟件項目合作，真正致力於解決現實世界中存在的問題，使用您可以處理數據的軟件和應用程序。 從那裡，我們發現我們確實沒有足夠的資金來維持我們想做的事情。 我們冒險使用替代融資方式，這驅使我們來到 Kickstarter，在那裡我們真正開始遵守我們為項目制定的標準。 其中一些標準是，無論我們創造什麼，它都必須具有令人難以置信的高品質，必須受到尊重，因其質量和對細節的奉獻而受到高度尊重。

我們的品牌和我們的項目的另一個標準是，它能給那些獲得體驗產品的人帶來快樂。 我想這也是對這個特定項目的懷舊之情，但實際上，我們可以為我們的產品帶來如此高的品質，並真正灌輸那種快樂感，真正讓任何人的一天都充滿活力。 這也是懷舊的事實，它是高質量的，這也是世界上許多人的學習工具，這有助於我們選擇這個項目。

現在通過這個過程，我們實際上有一個包含 20 個不同項目的清單，正如我之前提到的，這是我們決定的，因為我們所有人都真的記得那種觸覺體驗，我們的第一個玩具是木製旋轉玩具，我們只是順其自然並想創造它，並在後面加上一些小魔法，在它後面加上一些質量。

菲利克斯：有道理。 你有那些標準清單； 聽起來像你說的高品質，需要帶來快樂，然後也許作為獎勵是懷舊。 你有這個列表，我想也許其他正在考慮創業或考慮擴展其產品線的聽眾也有標準。 然後從那裡，你怎麼知道我猜你必須反對什麼樣的選擇？ 您是從那裡進行研究還是只是坐下來集思廣益，思考所有可能符合此標準列表的事情？

維克多：真的，只是方法非常獨特。 我們剛坐下。 我們考慮了我們可以做的事情。 我之前沒有提到的另一個標準是它也必須簡單。 簡約中真的有一種美，簡約中有一種優雅，你真的看不到太多了，尤其是高科技電話變得如此之多，高科技應用程序變得如此之多，以及你每天對技術的飽和程度。

我們想做的是給這個世界帶來一點簡單，讓每個人在忙碌的日常生活中保持平靜。 這是我們的另一個標準。 在我們的頭腦風暴會議中，我們只是經歷了不同的想法，思考什麼會很酷，什麼會非常獨特，我們還有能力創造什麼，因為我們作為專業人士和工程師的能力受到限制。 從那裡，我們有一個大約二十個想法的簡短列表，二十個可行的想法，我們選擇了陀螺，我們從未回頭。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 是否有任何其他產品幾乎晉級，或者是否有其他入圍者通過了標準列表，然後你不得不艱難地決定往哪個方向發展？

維克多：肯定有。 我們現在實際上正在開展一些項目。 我們希望將它們推向市場，我想這就是我能說的關於它們的程度，但它們也非常相關。 我們總是將質量的這一方面、簡單的方面和對細節的奉獻精神結合起來。 話雖如此，我們確實希望推向市場的這些新產品也是基於金屬的。 它們是金屬物體。 這也是我們提高效率的東西，也是我們可以可靠地提高客戶欣賞和期望我們的護理水平和質量水平的東西。

Felix ：你並沒有真正去詳細介紹這個其他產品，但聽起來好像因為你們想做另一個競爭產品，你怎麼知道不嘗試一下子做所有的？ 因為我認為這是很多企業家遇到的另一種情況，那就是我們有很多很棒的想法，其中很多都被引用/取消引用“derisked”，因為我們已經完成了一些練習或完成了一系列標準你們經歷過，但是你是如何強迫自己的，或者你怎麼知道不要嘗試不止一件事的發射？

維克多：真的，現在變得比過去更難了。 在過去，我們更專注於真正回到我們之前所做的工作，這就是我們正在從事的軟件項目，只是為我們真正致力於的工作獲得一些資金。 通過陀螺項目，我們在 Kickstarter 上啟動，並沒有真正預料到它會像現在這樣受歡迎和成功。 從那裡，我想我們得到了驗證，這是我們已經轉向的東西，也是我們現在非常非常自豪的東西。

我們有一個支持者社區，來自九十多個不同國家的個人，我們承諾，我們有義務，並且我們不斷為他們帶來新產品。 至於進入第一個項目，我想我們的情況有點不同，但我不認為這對我們來說會很困難，或者如果我們有不同的動機，它會更難。

費利克斯：有道理。 你們正在啟動 Kickstarter，得到了快速驗證，我們將對此進行詳細介紹，但是因為它變得如此迅速，所以很容易做出決定，嘿，這正在起飛，讓我們把時間花在什麼已經在工作了？

維克多：是的，絕對的。 任何 Kickstarter 項目的過程也是一個艱苦的過程，所以從你啟動一個項目的那一刻起，從你實際創建你的照片、你的原型，到這一切，到那時，你確實學到了很多東西。你實際上運送了所有的支持者，所有的貢獻者，獎勵，在這種情況下，他們正在旋轉陀螺。 那是一個非常謙卑的過程。 這是我們在此期間學到了很多東西，也是我們剛剛決定的事情。 我們有一些成對的手臂移位，這是我們很高興繼續進行的事情。

Felix ：我想在你們想做的第一件創業事情上退後一步。 你們是三個想要創業的創始人。 這就是創業的目標嗎，因為你之前說過你開始嘗試創辦一家軟件公司。 告訴我們，當你們坐下來說“讓我們一起開始一些事情”時，你們的動機是什麼。

維克多：真的是需要更好的東西。 更好的是，我從全球的角度說，因為對於許多不同的人來說，更好的情況可能會大不相同。 它可以是更好的賣家，它可以是更好的支付。 對我們來說，我們確實對質量有這種奉獻精神，這就是我們的信條，即質量、簡單以及我們可以為我們的創造帶來優雅的事實。 真的，這是我們開始自己的東西的動機。 我們真的想對我們創造的東西負責，我們想實現卓越，這是我們很高興看到其他企業家為之奮鬥的事情。

這確實是激勵因素，今天仍然推動著我們。 從專業角度和個人角度來看，我們一直努力實現的目標是持續增長。

Felix ：從現在主要使用數字，不一定是數字但不是有形產品到生產和銷售實體產品，這種轉變是什麼樣的？ 那個過渡是什麼樣的？ 有什麼東西，也許是你們必須掌握的一些新技能，因為你們從一開始就進入了這個新領域？

維克多：這絕對是一次非常艱苦的學習經歷，我們確實學到了很多東西。 實際上，考慮到我們早先在那個領域工作，我們不需要為此運送產品。 我們經歷了那個物流過程，實際上是如何將產品運送到 200 多個不同國家的發現階段。 隨著時間的流逝，您會學到很多東西，很多東西是您被迫學習的。 同樣，我們的驅動因素是我們對支持者的奉獻精神，我們對工藝和卓越的奉獻精神。 有了它，您可以實現的目標沒有真正的限制。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 當你決定專注於陀螺時，你們是否嘗試過以任何其他方式驗證產品，或者第一次真正的大驗證來自 Kickstarter 活動？

Viktor ：我們實際上在陀螺公司之前啟動了另一個項目。 這是一個不相關的項目，我們只是用來測試 Kickstarter 的水域。 除了驗證陀螺以及它們可能是什麼以及它們是什麼之外，我們決定將平台作為一個整體進行驗證，並真正通過一種了解運輸過程的方式來工作，了解真正如何實現的實現過程與全球觀眾交流。 從那裡，我們剛剛在 Kickstarter 上提出了旋轉陀螺項目。 幸運的是，它在某些情況下獲得了一定的吸引力並得到了病毒式的傳播，我們就成功了。 我們很幸運，在第一個項目上就成功了。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 有趣的是，您想首先驗證平台。 在過去的幾個月裡，我越來越頻繁地聽到這種說法，這是關於你應該如何真正嘗試首先弄清楚分銷渠道，不一定是實體分銷，而是如何傳達你的信息，如何讓你的產品推出以人為本。 聽起來這正是你們正在做的事情。 你想確保 Kickstarter 實際上是一種推出產品的可行方式，顯然你在此過程中也學到了很多東西。 你能說第一個項目是什麼，它是成功資助的嗎？

Viktor : 它被成功地資助了。 實際上，我們確實也經歷了另一次迭代，並添加了不同的內容。 這是一個豪華的項目。 它的表現不如 ForeverSpin 自然而然，也沒有通過幾次眾籌活動籌集到數百萬美元，但它對我們來說是一個非常強大的墊腳石，它確實讓我們學習了所有那些入門技能我們需要為 ForeverSpin 和我們的後續項目取得成功。

菲利克斯：讓我們談談那個。 你在第一個項目的第一個活動中加入了什麼，你說毛絨玩具，就是這樣嗎？

維克多：是的。

Felix ：有哪些事情，一些假設可能是你在 Kickstarter 上發起你的第一個活動，但在你運行活動時可能會改變？

Viktor ：實際上，我們很快就被證明是錯誤的第一個假設是您的客戶群的限制，您獲得的曝光率以及我們假設 Kickstarter 主要是由講英語的觀眾訪問，這是真的。 這是事實，但實際上現在我們的數據反映的是，幾乎 50% 的 Kickstarter 訪問者來自加拿大以外和美國以外，這帶來了很多潛在市場，很多可以看到您產品的潛在個人，可以對它感興趣並為自己挑選它。 這就是您必須建立在全球範圍內運輸的能力的地方。 那是第一件事。

從物流的角度來看，我們有一些事後需要了解的東西，但就營銷和整個平台而言，我們確實學到了很多東西。

Felix ：一旦你為陀螺發起了 Kickstarter 活動，你是否對產品進行了任何驗證，嘗試以任何其他方式銷售它，或者在啟動 Kickstarter 之前找到其他方式來驗證它，或者你們只是說，“讓我們把它放在 Kickstarter 上，看看會發生什麼，然後這就是驗證本身？”

Viktor ：對於第一個項目的 ForeverSpin，我們真的只是把它扔到了 Kickstarter 上，讓我們的工作質量不言而喻，這就是它被選中的方式。 這就是它變得流行的原因，因為我們確實致力於卓越和質量。 我們的營銷材料很到位。 人們只是喜歡我們的頁面，我們的陀螺。 他們再一次有那種懷舊的感覺，這有助於分享它，然後它就從那裡起飛了。

Felix ：當你發起旋轉的 Kickstarter 活動時，你說你從第一個活動中就學到了物流和運輸的知識。 您是否也學到了有關如何展示產品本身的知識？ 你在 Kickstarter 頁面上看到的東西太多了，你可以通過許多不同的方式通過你的 Kickstarter 將你的信息傳遞出去，還有很多優化它的方法。 從第一個 Kickstarter 活動（使用毛絨玩具）到你的 Kickstarter 活動到第一個旋轉陀螺活動，你學到了哪些關鍵的東西？

維克多：當然。 我們第一次競选和現在之間的時間很長。 在那段時間裡，我們學到了很多東西。 現在，我們甚至在第一次競選期間就學到了一些東西，我想這與現在的對話更相關，而不是它如何隨著時間的推移而演變，但首先我可以說，你真正需要關注的只是確保你對細節有敏銳的洞察力，以確保你的所有文字都是正確的，圖像是準確的，它們代表你的產品，它們拍攝得很好，光線充足，你的文字和方式你與你的支持者的交流也是普遍而簡單的。

有很多關鍵的事情是非常重要的。 視頻也有很多風格選擇是專門為全球觀眾設置的世界，而不僅僅是說英語的人群。

菲利克斯：你在那裡說了一些我想談的事情。 在您的頁面或視頻中包含哪些關鍵因素，以更加包容全球觀眾，而不僅僅是關註說英語的訪問者？

維克多：例如，從語言的角度來看，你所要做的就是真正嘗試簡化你的語言，確保它清晰、簡潔，並且盡可能讓世界上盡可能多的人理解它. 話雖如此，有谷歌翻譯，還有所有這些不同的服務，適用於 Chrome，適用於 Safari，可以為居住在土耳其的人翻譯頁面，但也可以為居住在中國的人翻譯頁面，但更容易傳達信息的是那些確實會說英語。 我可以保證，對於不會說英語的人來說，在翻譯之後，在翻譯之前，這也會更容易。 除此之外，實際圖像本身以及您展示產品的方式也非常重要。

例如，在圖像頁面上指出功能而不是在下面的項目符號列表中輸入它們，這對於全球受眾而不是英語受眾來說效果要好得多。

菲利克斯：我明白了。 基本上幾乎就像少說話，多展示。 顯示更多的圖像，或者只是不那麼依賴書面語言本身，但我想更多地通過圖像和視頻進行演示？

維克多：是的，完全正確。 它也確實更加強調了您的產品本身和產品的設計。 如果圖片比文字更能支持這一點，那麼從營銷的角度來看，這對你來說肯定是更好的，並且可以傳達你的信息。 對於我們的特定品牌，視頻對於陀螺來說比圖像更有效。 我們嘗試加入盡可能多的視頻，確保我們所有的信息、我們的觀點都在視頻中而不是下面的文字中出現。 尤其是對於陀螺，你必須親眼目睹才能真正欣賞它。 除此之外，你必須真正感受到它，獲得那種觸覺體驗，並在你面前看到它才能更加欣賞。 這就是我們能夠帶給我們的支持者、我們的客戶以及對這種體驗的期望的體驗。

菲利克斯：明白了。 你之前提到過你真的必須對細節有敏銳的洞察力。 根據您的經驗以及您查看的其他活動，是否有一些常見的細節是您發現其他活動缺少的，您肯定會建議新的 Kickstarter 活動創建者確保他們成功？

Vikto r：失踪，我不知道。 實際上，我個人不再關注那麼多項目了。 我們非常忙於我們的義務。 我們確保我們將世界各地的包裹運送給我們的支持者，但絕對要注意的一件事是我想不要添加，但要確保您不添加任何矛盾點，您確保您的項目頁面，您的演示文稿盡可能簡單，這可能會導致您只刪除大量文本，但如果您必須這樣做才能更好地傳達您的信息，那就簡單了。

菲利克斯：有道理。 我認為很多時候我們想把所有東西都拿出來，列出所有的功能，一切，但根據你剛才所說的話，我猜你強調支持更多地包容非英語人士觀眾不要用太多的詞，盡量簡單。 我認為這是一個很好的建議。 當您通過頁面上的副本創建這些 Kickstarter 頁面時，無論是使用您的視頻還是圖像，您是否為此聘請了任何幫助，或者這一切都是在內部完成的？

Viktor ：迄今為止的一切都是在內部完成的。 這是我們非常自豪的事情。 我們在多倫多擁有的團隊，他們非常出色。 他們做得很好，這一切都始於我們對質量的奉獻和對卓越的奉獻。 歸根結底，有很多活動我們相信在內部總是會做得更好，因為我們首先想像它們。 我們知道它應該是什麼樣子，我們知道它應該如何寫，應該如何描繪，我們不相信有很多人能夠在這種能力上比我們自己更成功。

菲利克斯：你有沒有覺得你試圖承擔一切可能會讓自己太瘦？ 您是否遇到過這個問題，並試圖不必保留所有內容，而是將其全部保留在內部？ 您是否覺得自己在任何時候都在嘗試自己處理所有事情時遇到了限制？ 不是你自己，而是公司本身？

維克多：是的，絕對的。 肯定有這種擔憂，隨著團隊的壯大，我們會減輕這種擔憂。 我們培訓我們添加到團隊中的個人以便能夠執行我們的任務。 我猜你所說的，這與僱用專業人士或僱用某些公司相同。 真的，我們最終會更加關心我們的項目。 我們確實投入了總是丟失或大部分時間丟失的額外里程。 當你為別人的項目工作時，並不是那麼強調細節，也不是太注重卓越。

菲利克斯：我明白了。 如果你確實需要一些特別的幫助，你們會在公司內部僱傭他們，並根據你的精神或你的理念對他們進行關於這種卓越和專注於質量的基本培訓？ 這就是你的意思嗎？ 你不會外包它，但如果你想在那裡得到一些幫助，你會在內部僱傭他們並培訓他們？

Viktor ：到目前為止，我們遇到的大多數問題以及我們在增長中的大部分挑戰都是由直屬團隊和創始團隊在內部解決的。 我們確實有很強的解決問題的能力，這就是我們的優勢所在。 我們的很多問題已經在內部解決了。 這是我們非常自豪能夠完成的事情。 對於一些更高級別的任務、編程工作等等，我們會外包​​出去，但就我們品牌的質量而言，這是我們傾向於內部保留的東西。

菲利克斯：我明白你在說什麼。 質量就像您的品牌和公司的核心競爭力。 任何需要或需要維護這種質量的東西，你們都有立場將其保留在內部。 任何與質量核心無關的東西，那麼你更願意實際外包或在外面招聘？

維克多：是的，完全正確。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 讓我們談談你的 Kickstarter 活動，一些 ForeverSpin 的活動。 看起來你們已經發起了三個活動，都非常成功。 你能給我們簡要介紹一下我猜這三個人籌集的資金嗎？

維克多：當然。 我們發起的第一個活動是在 2014 年，它是在年初的 2 月推出的，而那個活動是我們沒有真正得到驗證的活動。 我們把它扔到了 Kickstarter 上，我們得到了巨大的社區支持。 我們有很多人打電話給我們，詢問要添加的不同金屬，詢問擴大我們的收藏，這促使我們在未來創建更多的 Kickstarter 項目。 第一次競選，它籌集了大約 140,000 美元，有 17 或 1800 名支持者。 從那裡開始，實現這一目標的時期就是學習時期。 我們學到了很多關於如何真正管理我們的項目、如何執行製造、如何執行我們的運輸以及真正如何處理所有這些的知識。 如果沒記錯的話，我相信這個項目在 7 月或 8 月完成。

從那裡開始，我們開始研究下一個陀螺迭代，在 Kickstarter 上可以找到 ForeverSpin 2.0。 現在，我們再次將 ForeverSpin 2.0 添加到我們的收藏中。 最初的系列是十個陀螺，在 2.0 中，我們添加了一些非常、非常獨特的陀螺，我們也為能夠真正接觸到以前從未做過的非常創新的東西而感到自豪。 我們用黑銠、白銠、鍍銀、鑄鐵和玫瑰金製作了一些陀螺，這是我們在 2014 年 10 月啟動的第二個 Kickstarter 項目中添加到我們系列中的陀螺。後來那一年，我們在該項目中籌集了大約 400,000 美元，有 3800 名支持者。

該系列還包括我們系列的另一個補充，即旋轉底座，這是我們的支持者強烈要求的項目。 現在，真正讓我們與許多其他項目創建者和 Kickstarter 上的許多社區不同的是，我們對我們的支持者有著非常強烈的奉獻精神。 我們確實回到 Kickstarter 的真正原因是為了滿足他們的需求。 有很多完全熟悉 Kickstarter 的人喜歡支持該平台，並且非常願意在網上和其他地方購買。 話雖如此，我們帶著他們的建議回到了 Kickstarter，他們提出了他們的建議，並將他們要求的物品帶到了市場。

例如，旋轉底座，我們收藏的配件，它是專門為他們準備的。 我相信我們的第一批支持者要求了 203 次，其他金屬也被要求了 100 多次，玫瑰金非常非常受歡迎。 Wee 總是將我們的項目奉獻給我們的支持者。 第二次活動於 12 月結束，我們在次年 7 月成功交付了所有支持者獎，然後我們開始著手另一個項目，這又是擴大我們的收藏。 我們重新設計了我們的紡紗底座，我們重新設計了一些項目和一些比例，在這方面，我們再次對我們的支持者進行了非常強烈的奉獻，以擴大我們的收藏，以確保它盡可能高品質。 在那方面，我們剛剛從我們的觀眾和我們的支持者那裡得到了持續的支持，取得了很大的成功。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 讓我們從第一個項目開始，即籌集了近 14,000 美元的 ForeverSpin 陀螺活動。 看起來你最初的目標，我不確定這是加元還是美元，上面寫著 1,500 美元。 無論哪種方式，您籌集的最終金額都會破壞非常緩慢的目標。 你們準備得如何，幾乎擁有，這是什麼，你最終籌集的最初目標的一百倍？ 你們為這種巨額資金做好準備了嗎？

維克多：絕對不是。 這導致了很多深夜。 實際上，我們非常致力於我們的支持者，以確保我們盡快履行我們的責任並真正履行義務。 它確實導致了很多非常晚的夜晚，確保我們將我們的每一根能量都提供給我們的支持者，這是一個很好的教訓。 這不是我們所期望的。 這是我們面臨的問題，最終我們克服了。

菲利克斯：太棒了。 初始金額 1,500 美元，我猜你需要這筆資金做什麼？ 只是為了驗證嗎？ 與創業公司合作似乎不是很多錢？ 你需要那 1500 美元做什麼？

維克多：那是為了一些原型設計。 只要確保我們有完美的設計，並且設計確實經歷了很多次迭代。 我相信我們經歷了數百張圖紙，數百次重新設計，以確保我們確實擁有完美的陀螺，從外觀和陀螺的角度來看。 那裡有一點雙重功能。 從性能的角度來看，它必須看起來非常優雅，同時也運行得非常好。 這是一個非常好的平衡。 這是我們已經能夠實現的目標，而且速度並不快。 這不是一夜之間發生的。 這是我們確實需要資金的事情。 除此之外，只是為了確保我們的流程是可靠的，確保我們添加到我們收藏中的金屬也是完整的。

我們使用了一些合金和一些不同的純金屬，它們是非常非常罕見的機器，它們很少使用，這也是我們非常自豪能夠將它們帶到我們的系列中的東西。

菲利克斯：一旦你在這結束時確實達到了 140,000 美元的資金目標，再次，來自近 1900 名支持者，下一步是什麼？ 實際上，在我到達那里之前，您能夠以多快的速度突破那個目標？ 是不是很早，比如第一天，還是你多久打破了 1,500 美元的目標？

維克多：我想它發生在十七個小時之內。 這太瘋狂了。 然後從那裡，第二天也有幾千個訂單，活動的最後三天也剛剛爆發。 這不是我們所期望的，但我們確實面對它，我們最終克服了它，這是我們非常高興的事情。

菲利克斯：你怎麼看，你們是怎麼這麼快就獲得牽引力的？ 1,500 美元顯然很棒，但在整個競選期間籌集 140,000 美元顯然更好。 發生了什麼事？ 您是如何推動流量和推廣活動的？

Viktor ：Kickstarter 的運作方式確實會在某些項目立即啟動時獎勵它們的可見性。 歸根結底，Kickstarter 是關於成功資助項目的。 它確實在項目啟動時誇大了項目的可見性，只是為了創造這種嗡嗡聲，在這些項目中創造意義和可見性。 僅僅基於我們的陀螺的優點，我們確實立即獲得了很大的吸引力，很多人都喜歡這個想法，而且我們有回頭客。 我們已經將收藏品運送到學校，為過去支持我們的老師、博物館，甚至大學。

我們的收藏非常受歡迎，Kickstarter 自身的可見性及其排序算法和項目的外觀對我們幫助很大。 在那方面，隨著嗡嗡聲越來越大，隨著越來越多的人開始談論它，我們被一些新聞媒體報導了，這也有很大幫助。 沒有真正的公關。 我們在內部沒有做任何事情來支持這種流量。 它只是有機地來了。

Felix ：我從一開始也從其他活動中聽到了這一點，這就是你所說的如果你能儘早獲得牽引力，因為 Kickstarter 是成功資助活動的激勵措施，他們會想要突出顯示成功資助的活動。 早點做了什麼？ 您是否向朋友和家人宣傳它？ How did you get that early traction to get Kickstarter to pay attention to an obviously great product and everything, but how did you even get them to notice your product in the first place?

Viktor : Yeah, it was something that we did promote to our friends and family. They naturally helped in the start, but really we we our success and the funding of that project to the Kickstarter community. The first person sees it, then they let one of their friends know, "Hey, this is very cool." Then that second person sees it, and from there Kickstarter's algorithm kicks it. It just boosts the front page, to the What's Popular page, to the top design page, and from there it's just something that spiraled and you did get that viral affect or that pseudo viral affect.

Felix : Once you raised $140,000, was this a thirty-day campaign or how long did it run for?

Viktor : Thirty-five days.

Felix : After that thirty-five days ran and you guys had a good amount of cash, capital to invest in the business, what was the next step? Did you have to get manufacturers? What was the very next thing you guys decided to do once you got that check? I'm not sure how Kickstarter pays you, gives you the money, but once you got the money in the accounts, what did you guys do immediately?

Viktor : Again, we just went back into the design stage. We learned a lot about our product as well and about what the customer wants as we did launch the product. We had seventeen hundred people send us hundreds of emails, thousands of emails and we actually had them call us on a dedicated hotline as well, which is something that not a lot of other project creators do. In that, we just went back to the drawing board, or I guess returned to the drawing board just to make sure that our product and our spinning tops are as elegant and as high performance as they can be, maintaining that balance between the two. There was a lot of design work that had to be done.

Beyond that, the next stage was to make sure that we select the right materials, that we use only the finest alloys. We started sourcing our materials and manufacturers, and from there it was just making sure that that manufacturing process is coordinated, that we have all the quality control checks in place since we are a company that is highly dedicated to quality and making sure that we do have a very keen eye as to what we do ship to our customers and to our backers.

Felix : I was going to ask about that because you emphasize on this episode and on your Kickstarter campaign and on your store about this, quality and attention to detail, which I can imagine could be stressful when you are looking for a manufacturer and making sure that they are adhering to your standards, and there's probably listeners out there that don't need this kind of attention to detail, but can still probably benefit from your device on this. What can you do to ensure that manufacturers are producing things to your standards?

Viktor : Naturally there's several quality control checks, and they actually start at the material stage before the manufacturing stage. It is very important that you have stringent QHX at each process of your manufacturing process. There's the shipping of materials that has to be checked before and after departure with a composition test making sure that your tops are exactly as you designed them, that they're exactly to spec.

Felix : Are you testing this or is there somebody that's at the manufacturer testing this?

Viktor : There would be manufacturers testing it, there would be intermediaries testing it, just making sure that we have the best materials that we could possibly get. The best materials in the context of what we're doing.

Felix : I don't know anything about this stuff, but are you giving them specific numbers and then from the test you want your alloys, your metals to hit a certain I guess number of purity or quality? I'm not sure what the right term for it is, but are you doing this in a quantitative way, saying, "Hey, I want you to test this," but has it hit these particular checkpoints?

Viktor : That's exactly right. For instance, the copper that we use is 99.9 percent pure. This is something that not a lot of people machine. It's not a metal that's commonly found as well. Most people do get copper in an alloy state, which is either bronze or brass. With copper, that 99.9 percent pure, it does have to be checked for purity, does have to be checked for contents and for everything like that. There are the other metals that we did use that we introduced to our collection. For instance, the titanium, we use a very high grade of titanium. That has to be checked for composition as well to make sure that it does abide exactly by our specifications; otherwise it's not what we had promised to our customer. We promised the highest creative titanium possible for the context of what we do for our spinning tops, and that's something that we intend to deliver on.

That's something that's very important to us and that did go through that QH process.

Felix : One thing you were saying about the campaign, the very first one that was happening, and then as you're gearing for you second one, was about how you got a lot of feedback. I think feedback is obviously invaluable, and you said that you even had a hotline set up to get this feedback. What were you doing I guess to solicit feedback? I think this is a problem that other entrepreneurs might run into, which is that they want to do things to improve their business, they want to improve the product, but they're not getting enough feedback from their customers. Are you guys doing anything specific to try to get people to give more of their opinion to you guys?

Viktor : Not really anything specific, no. Again, really Kickstarter is among the top thousand visited websites in the world. It is a website that gets a lot of traffic through it day in, day out, and if there's enough people excited about your project, then you do open up that possibility for them to speak with the founders, to speak with a member of the staff, to make their suggestions and to improve ultimately a project that they back and an item that they purchase. It's something that a lot of individuals are open to the opportunity of. With respect to our spinning tops, it is something that a lot of people are excited for, and just again, on the basis of that, there's a lot of individuals that called. We had hundreds of calls, and unfortunately it's just not something that's shared. There's not an ideology that's shared by a lot of Kickstarter project creators.

There's not many projects that do have that line open, that do have that dedicated telephone line for individuals to call.

Felix : Can you say a little bit more about this, just in case there's anybody out there that's thinking about launching campaign and wants to be really tapped into the potential customers? How do you set up, what is this hotline that you set up? Is it just a cell phone number, and how do you display it on your Kickstarter page?

Viktor : We effectively bought a dedicated telephone line, and that was tethered to our cell phone, so whenever somebody called we would answer. We would speak with our backers. We would take in their feedback, and again, when you have that personal connection with one of your customers and as a customer, when you have that connection with the founder, the person that you're buying something from, you do feel much more special, and that's something that you're very happy to support and support in perpetuity and through project iterations, through additions to that product find, and we are very grateful to all of our backers.

Felix : One other thing you mentioned in the I guess pre-interview things that we were talking about was about how social proof is really important for you guys. 你能多談談這個嗎？ What does social proof mean for anybody out there that might not know what that is and how does it help you with your business?

Viktor : Naturally transitioning into Kickstarter and to our website, which is where we make sales on a daily basis, we do sell on ForeverSpin.com, it's something that significantly supports your brand and significantly supports the perception that people are buying this item. A spinning top isn't something that everybody would buy. The reality of it, it's just the way that it is. When you do have that social proof, when you do see that, hey, my neighbor bought it or somebody that lives a few blocks down from me bought it in the state of Pennsylvania or the state of wherever, or in X country, that's something that really supports the fact that we do bring something that's very special to the entire world. Now we have shipped to over ninety different countries, and that's something that supports our social standing and supports the fact that we do ship, that we're a very legitimate company and that we are here to stay.

Felix : What do you mean by social proof though? Just so I can clarify for listeners, social proof is just basically the validation I guess from your peers, like you were saying, your neighbors or your family that have purchased this, and because they purchased it, you feel a little bit less, it becomes less risky for you to purchase it as well. How do you demonstrate something like that either in a Kickstarter or on your Shopify store? How do you emphasize that there's been I guess social proof for your product?

Viktor : Transitioning into our website now, again, it did go through Kickstarter, and on Kickstarter the numbers speak for themselves. There's eighteen hundred people that supported our first project. There's thirty-seven hundred people that supported our second project, and five thousand people that supported our third project. This is from all walks of like all over the world, and it's something that people can join. We really have a community here where our customers speak to each other on the message board that exists within Kickstarter as a platform. Now beyond that, there's Facebook, there's just the reviews that come from the individuals that we've shipped spinning tops to, the social proof that we got from Dragon's Den as well, which is the Canadian equivalent of Shark Tank, which was somewhere we were very happy to be included.

When you have that proof it becomes undeniable, and there is a stage at which people say, hey, this is a very legitimate product. This is something that I was skeptical about at first, and now something I really want.

Felix : It looks like one of the keys is that you've had a lot of very public purchases or at least pre-orders through Kickstarter, makes it a lot less risky purchase for other people because they see that lot of two thousand, five thousand or whatever the other number was, a lot of thousands of people are already buying this product, which makes them not necessarily only trust you guys more, but then also want it. Because they're like, "Why is everyone buying this? Let me take a look at it." 你是這個意思嗎？

Viktor : Yeah, that's exactly right. To put it into simplest terms, nobody wants to be the first. You go to Amazon and you see some product listing that sells all over the world but it has two units sold. You don't want to be that second person, you don't want to be that fourth person to test an item that you may not believe has the quality that's promised. You want to be that seven thousandth person that's supporting it and that knows that you're getting something good, and really that's the social proof that we've gotten. It's with that support and with that audience and our thankful ability to have been able to ship to thousands of individuals all over the world that we're able to do that.

Felix : I'm not sure if you guys experienced this with Kickstarter, but if you are launching on Kickstarter this is why it's really important to try to get that early traction, because if someone doesn't know you and haven't ever heard of you and they come to your Kickstarter page and zero people have funded it, you're not going to want to be the first one, but if you have your network, your friends and family who already do trust you, who don't need social proof, if they're the first ones to help support you or your business or you Kickstarter campaign, then that starts this kickoff of social proof. Just by the fact that there is more than one person already that's supporting this campaign could be enough to compel strangers to also back it.

涼爽的。 Let's talk about the shipping because you mentioned this a couple times. You ship to did you say ninety countries or what was the number?

Viktor : Yeah, we've now shipped to over ninety different countries.

菲利克斯：太棒了。 What is that experience? How do you set up your I guess supply chain, your logistics to be able to ship to over ninety different countries?

Viktor : Essentially we've been searching for a very long term for a perfect solution, and it hasn't been an easy search. In time and as you dedicate enough time to that, enough resources, you do find the ability to do so. You find partners that can ship all over the world for you and different companies, and that's something that we have put our trust into. We've found these companies that can ship all over the world, that can ship packages with tracking information, comprehensive tracking checkpoints. It is something that just, we didn't have the ability to do before and I have never dreamed of being able to ship to all of these different countries, but it's something that in retrospect just seems incredibly easy, but it's not the easiest transition to get into.

Felix : Do you have to work with multiple logistics and shipping companies to do this, or is there a central one that you can maybe recommend that listeners check out, if they want to be able to ship globally?

Viktor : We did go through several different companies, at least in our search, and there's a few companies that will definitely be better than others, but I can't recommend a specific company over a different ones because there's a lot of variations in your cost depending on what you're shipping and where you're shipping. There is a lot of options, and you just have to do your due diligence, which is another thing that we believe is just with every decision that you make you have to make sure that all the options are laid out on the table, and that you have a very understanding of why you're doing what you're doing.

Felix : Maybe you can tell us what kind of key factors that our listeners should look out for if they are looking to partner with a shipping or logistics company to ship globally. What are some important things that they should either ask the company or include in their research?

Viktor : Naturally first and foremost, there's cost. There's going to be a cost of you shipping. Then there's transit times, there's tracking capabilities. A lot of individuals, especially with Amazon being so incredibly popular and widely used, a lot of people expect tracking information for their packages, and this is true for destinations all over the world. Those are really the three biggest facts, and transit time is becoming much, much more important than it had been in the past.

Felix : I see. 這就說得通了。 涼爽的。 I want to talk now about branding. You mentioned this as well, something that you wanted to talk about, which is the importance of having a brand. I think that word is just so I guess in general is a vague word. Maybe for you, on a day to day basis, what are you as a company or maybe what are you personally doing to I guess establish and push the ForeverSpin brand?

Viktor : Branding yeah, again, just exactly as you had said, it is a very broad word and it's hard to define in one sentence because there are so many factors that accumulate with the amalgam of what a brand actually is. With that, there's definitely social aspects and this goes back to the social proof that we spoke of. Really to break it down in how we establish our brand is just making sure that we do dedicate our products to quality, to make sure that every single spinning top is 99.9 percent pure copper, to make sure that every titanium top is indestructible and perfectly balanced. With that, you just get a lot of individuals that have an appreciation for your product, they do share with individuals, you get that social proof, you get individuals sharing with their friends and family, and it trickles down from your customer base and the people that you're loyal to. First and foremost, if you're loyal to your product.

Felix : You're focusing on the product itself, making sure that the product is upholding the brand. Outside of the product, are there other ways for you either through marketing that you focus on or someone from your team focuses on to make sure that the brand is established?

Viktor : All the creatives that we do, and we do advertise online as well. We advertise through Facebook, through Google AdWords. Pretty much all the creatives that we have, they do all reinforce that image of quality, that image of simplicity as well as excellence. It is something that is uniform. It's constant across all of our outlets, for all of our partners that we engage with, for our own marketing efforts in-house, for the companies that retail our product and that sell our spinning tops, it's something that we demand from ourselves first and foremost.

Felix : Now after you had funded on Kickstarter I think the first time, is that when you open up the Shopify store or when did you open the Shopify store?

Viktor : We opened the Shopify store just before we aired on Dragon's Den, which was November of 2015, just last November.

Felix : This was after all three campaigns?

Viktor : This was after two campaigns. The third one was launched in December. We launched this last campaign in December, and it had actually run in concurrence to our store being live.

Felix : Did you have a storefront on another platform? Were you capturing any I guess other demand after the campaign ended? What'd you do about that?

Viktor : We did have a store. It was a custom store that we built ourselves. It wasn't Shopify, it wasn't really any other platform, and we did switch to Shopify we found that it was a much, much better solution for us. Ever since we made the switch, it's been significantly better.

Felix : Did you do anything to drive traffic to that very first store or is it mostly just from the traffic that was coming from the Kickstarter page? How do you transition from Kickstarter to your own store? How do you transition that kind of buzz?

Viktor : The very first thing that we did get traffic from was actually Dragon's Den, and we did launch that Shopify store a little bit before Dragon's Den. There are a million individuals that watched that episode, that watched that specific episode, that watch every episode for that matter. We did drive a lot of traffic from there. From that, we just gained a lot of valuable data. We really, again, established who our customers were, and from there we've had a lot of initiatives. We've had our paid advertising campaigns. We've had some social campaigns as well that have been targeting those individuals. There is always inbound traffic. A lot of it is paid, but we do have alternative means as well, and definitely it all started with that Dragon's Den appearance and Kickstarter's incredibly influential factor as well.

Felix : What are the plans for this year? I know that you were talking about working on some other products that you can't say much about coming up, but are there any other big goals that you as a company want to hit for 2016?

維克多：當然。 For ForeverSpin, we're looking to get our collection into a lot more schools. That's something that we're focusing very hard on. We have this educational aspect for our collection, and really we call the ForeverSpin collection the metal museum. That's because all of our collection, they are in different metals. Now we have a variety of over eighteen, and in that variety there's a significant amount of variance and variety in our collection. I can gather from what I know about most of the population is that you for instance, you've never held solid titanium and solid tungsten in one hand and the other at the same time, is that correct?

Felix : That's correct.

Viktor : For instance, when you have that tactile experience firsthand, you'll never forget that tungsten is signification heavier than titanium is. You'll never remember what the texture of solid nickel is or how much bronze weighs or that copper develops a patina over time. That's just things that we're very passionate about bringing to schools and bringing that learning, that tactile experience to children all over the world. That's something that we've started to do. There are a couple schools that we've gotten into that have shown our collection, taking it to their science classrooms, to their students for stress relief, for brainstorming sessions, for just getting some more focus. It's something that we're, very, very happy to be doing in the future.

菲利克斯：太棒了。 Thanks so much Viktor. ForeverSpin.com is the website. FOREVERSPIN dot com is the website and the store. You can definitely Google ForeverSpin Kickstarter campaigns if you want to see how they built their Kickstarter pages. Anywhere else that you recommend listeners check out if they want to follow along with what you guys are up to?

Viktor : Definitely our Kickstarter would be a very good starting point. Our website is also up to date and it does feature our entire collection minus what's available on Kickstarter. In addition to our Kickstarter page right now, we do have an active collection on Indiegogo.com. Also another crowd funding platform where you can find our newest five tops from our collection.

Felix : What made you make that transition from Kickstarter to launching on Indiegogo?

Viktor : Indiegogo is right now the campaign that's running on Indiegogo is an in demand campaign. It's effectively a campaign that runs in perpetuity. Again, just going back to the fact that there are a lot of individuals that are very wary of making purchases online. They're strictly and exclusively comfortable with Kickstarter, with Indiegogo, with Amazon.ca for instance or Amazon.com, and really just going back to we do have a very strong dedication to our customer base, to our backers and there's a lot of people that have been requesting it which is why we've gone back to Kickstarter three times and back to Indiegogo.

Felix : Very interesting. You're basically saying that the customers that you have and probably maybe a lot of other listeners might have these customers too, they only feel comfortable buying through certain almost websites. Kickstarter was what you guys cut your teeth on and noticed at first, but then you also now find that some customers feel best funding or buying through Indiegogo, so that's why you're launching there even though you don't necessarily need to launch on Indiegogo, is that correct?

Viktor : Yeah, that's exactly right. It's out best channel for communication as well. That's why we're acquainted with them, with a lot of our customers and a lot of our backers, and that's where we're happy to come back to bring that collection to them.

菲利克斯：太棒了。 I think that's a great gem. I'm glad that I asked why you launched with Indiegogo too. 這很有意義。 I never considered that people might not feel comfortable or maybe feel more comfortable buying on Kickstarter or Indiegogo for whatever reason they might have. 這很有意義。 驚人的。 Thanks so much again Viktor. Again, ForeverSpin.com, look up ForeverSpin on Indiegogo for a live campaign, or is it called in demand campaign, which I guess should be running in perpetuity, like you said, and ForeverSpin on Kickstarter if you want to see the past campaigns.

Thanks again so much for coming on Viktor.

Viktor : Thank you Felix. It's been a pleasure speaking with you.

Felix : Thanks for listening to Shopify Masters, the e-commerce marketing podcast for ambitious entrepreneurs. To start your store today, visit Shopify.com for a free fourteen-day trial.